February 19, 2008

This blog has permanently moved to a new location:

www.iamanatheist.com/blog

Please change those bookmarks -- thanks!

September 16, 2007

Oh not my God! I was already an Atheist before I got to this site, so am I now an Atheist squared?
No, you're a theist twice removed.

You cannot escape the fact that atheism is hate speech. You are saying that everyone who believes in GOD is stupid and wrong when you say you are an atheist. This is the same as saying you are a white supremecist and everyone who is BLACK is stupid and wrong or that we should kill the JEWS. Does blogger know that they are publishing hate speech? I'm going to tell them!!
You couldn't be further from the truth, and your even thinking such things makes me rather sad. Atheism -- at least Moral Atheism, as I call it -- is not about calling names or saying who is smarter than who. It's also not about being "anti" anything. It's just a set of beliefs like any other, albeit one that was arrived at through a specific process of reasoning and that concludes there is no compelling reason to believe in deities. You might reason using similar tools to mine and come to different conclusions. That's fine.

If you are angry at atheists or have a bad impression of us because you have heard ant-religious speech from atheists in the past, you should know that not all atheists are like that. Many -- probably most -- of us are quite tolerant of those we disagree with.

I have been reading some of the writings on your site and on your blog and I would first like to congratulate you on a job well done.

I would however like to take exception with the oft-stated sentiment that religious people aren't unintelligent. In the context of their beliefs in a sky-god, they are most certainly, in every sense of the word, unintelligent. They may not be unintelligent in everyday life, but in this case they are. By way of analogy, Let's take a look at Hugo. Hugo paints, plays several musical instruments, sculpts, writes, and does origami--all with a high degree of skill. But Hugo can't sing. He has a terrible voice. When he sings in the shower, the locals speak in whispers of the chupacabra. Would anyone refer to Hugo as untalented? Certainly not. But if I want to take singing lessons, would you recommend I go see Hugo? Again, certainly not. Because in the context of singing, he IS untalented. And if, when discussing the art of singing with Hugo we go out of our way to praise his skill, aren't we being both insincere and condescending?

Every human has some degree of intelligence. Sometimes we make use of that intelligence and sometimes we let others tell us what to think. Religion is letting others tell us what to think. If you show me someone who lets every conceivable facet of his life be dictated to him, and I will say that that person has NO intelligence--none that he makes use of anyway.

When someone says that, for them empirical proof can be found in a 2000-year-old book that has been losing battles over "truth", both scientific and social, since the day it was written, I think that we can say that in the context of religion, they ARE unintelligent. They are not using the tools necessary for intelligent thought. They are letting the views of others become their own without any critical evaluation as to the truth of those views. And that is most certainly not intelligent.
There are unintelligent theists, just as there are unintelligent atheists. However, I do not think theism is a sufficient condition for labeling someone as unintelligent.

Although I understand your argument, I think it is based on a number of assumptions, some of which are not true. Not all theists slavishly follow the instructions of their church or believe that every word in the Bible is true. Many are quite critical of what their religion teaches and have investigated their beliefs in detail. Some people are religious because, after considering the alternatives, they honestly believe that religion is the most likely alternative.

To step back in history a bit, let's look at Thomas Jefferson (one of my heroes, by the way). He was a theist, if only barely, because he could not conceive of a universe coming into existence without a deity. He believed that Jesus existed, but didn't believe in those parts of the Bible that involved magic, hence his putting together The Jefferson Bible. We certainly have more scientific information today than Jefferson did, but I wouldn't call him unintelligent for reaching the conclusions he reached, and I wouldn't call someone today who reached the same conclusions unintelligent because they do not think science's explanations for the origin of the universe are sufficient.

Continuing with this, we must recognize that people have different levels of necessary proof. I'm personally very skeptical about the supernatural and think that all natural explanations must be ruled out before supernatural ones are considered. Others think supernatural explanations are more likely. I think they're wrong but I can't prove it (as a general case), so I can't say that their conclusions drawn from these lower levels of need for evidence are wrong unless I can demonstrate that they have reached an incorrect conclusion (which, in the case of believing God exists, I can't).

As for the Bible, there are copious arguments for its historicity. For example, there is an argument that the New Testament is likely reliable because it recounts both negative and positive aspects of the early church. I disagree with these arguments (in general), but they are good enough that I wouldn't say that someone who is convinced by them is unintelligent. At most, they are merely wrong, and one can be both intelligent and wrong.

Finally, as a general rule I assume that everyone is intelligent. That way I am less likely to dismiss the ideas of others because I consider my beliefs to be superior to theirs. I'm not saying that this is what you are doing, but it might be something to keep in mind.

Your funny.
You'll be even funnier burning in hell with Satin's dick up your ass.
Satin?

I've spent a bit of time reading the comments and your wonderful responses. I really admire you ability to remain so calm in the face of such awful bigotry and non-nonsensical comments.

What I fine truly ironic is that such hate can come from those who preach and "believe" in love. I realise how lucky I am to live in a country where I am not denounced for my lack of belief.

Thanks again :o)
I am a strong believer in separation of religion and government, and I feel truly sad for those who are not able to speak their thoughts for fear of government retaliation. But I think the first step toward getting more governments to not judge is to get more people to not judge, and that is turning out to be quite a task.

How long have you been involved in the skeptical movement? What are your favorite podcasts?
This may be a lame answer, but I don't consider myself to be involved in the skeptical movement. I'm just a skeptic. I am, however, a gigantic fan of James Randi and Isaac Asimov, and read Skeptical Enquirer for many years.

Favorite podcasts at the moment: Skeptic's Guide to the Universe, Onion Radio News, Come Let Us Reason (currently falling from favor a bit), Logically Critical, Stand to Reason (new to me but currently gaining favor), Skeptoid, 60-Second Science, Old-Time Dragnet, and Rantamonica.